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## Investigating Long-Term Investment Options for a Hungarian Citizen Living in Italy

An EU citizen from Hungary who is currently residing and working in Italy is seeking advice on how to allocate 40k – 50k Euros for long-term investment purposes. While traditional banks are not offering interest on Euro accounts, a friend has suggested considering options such as IBKR and Hungarian government bonds.

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AI Legalese Decoder can assist in deciphering complex legal terminology and navigating the legal jargon associated with investment opportunities. By utilizing this tool, individuals can gain a better understanding of the terms and conditions linked to various investment options, thus making informed decisions regarding their financial future.

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6 Comments

  • domjant

    If you live in Italy, then you are an Italian tax resident. So HU state bonds not necessarily good for you, as you would have to pay Italian tax after that investment (vs tax free for HU tax residents).

  • Polaroid1793

    If you plan to continue to live in Italy long term it’s probably better a national broker as they make the taxes for you. The best bets are Directa Sim and Fineco.
    Interactive brokers is good but you will need to file taxes for yourself. Given you seem to be starting now I guess you don’t have an advanced knowledge, so better avoid that pain.
    In terms of investments:before speaking of money you should think of what are your long terms goals in life, spending and saving situation (current and future for what you can foresee). Based on that you can start to think in what instruments to invest.
    For example, at first you would need to have a safety net (at least 6 months of living expenses). Then you might want to invest for pension (in this case ETFs are a good idea) or maybe you want to buy a house in 5 years (in this case better bonds or terms deposits as stocks are volatile). So set up your goals and situation first. If you speak Italian go to the Italy Personal Finance subreddit and check the wiki, there are plenty of valuable info.

  • fnezio

    Go to /r/Italiapersonalfinance, they will tell you VWCE if long term, XEON if short term. I like Fineco as my bank.

  • glimz

    Listen to what Italian residents say, and if that’s to get a local broker to make tax filing easier, consider that (with IBKR being an option if you find the fees excessive and can manage taxes on your own).

    HU government bonds (since recently) withhold 15% of interest payments to foreign natural persons, which will hit you, esp. if you are saving in a tax-advantaged account ([PIR](https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piani_individuali_di_risparmio)) & unable to get tax credit. You can get the money back per HU-IT double taxation treaty (treaty rate is 0%), but this process isn’t likely to be automatic or cheap, if handled by the broker (unlike for US securities, where you usually just fill a form and start enjoying treaty rates). Assuming your broker isn’t exceptional in this regard, this means that unless you put a big chunk of the money in HU bonds, it might not be worthwhile to do the return, so you can regard HU bonds as having worse net yield than others which do not withhold (e.g. Romania).

    Investing in higher-yielding EU members’ debt will give good results, esp. if tax free, but keep in mind that there is a fundamental reason the rates are higher. If a really huge crisis happens, so bad that some EU members default, it will probably be these EU members. You can get close to 4% with a money market fund that invests only in public debt by higher-rated EU members (unlike bonds, subject to fall immediately, if rates sink). You can get a bit more from a MMF fund that invests in high-quality bank commercial paper, corp. bonds, etc. (it’s not clear whether such a fund will fall before less creditworthy EU members in a crisis scenario).

    Since you mention long term, you should probably add stocks to your portfolio. I’ve only glanced through what a PIR is, but I read that it can be used to hold UCITS ETFs, has a yearly investment limit of €40K (there’s also a total maximum), and requires holding for 5 years to be tax-free, so seems like a good way to invest? If by long term you mean > 20 years, consider that bonds have an extremely small chance of outperforming stocks for such a timeframe: the main reason you may want them is to safeguard in case things don’t go to plan & you have to sell prematurely at in inopportune moment.

  • laughingminion

    Unfortunately I don’t speak fluent Italian as yet.

  • FibonacciNeuron

    HU Government bonds? Don’t let nationalism guide sound financial decision!